Hi,
wie mir auffällt habe ich lange nichts mehr gepostet… zum Einen wegen dem Uni-Stress zum Anderen fehlte mir die Inspiration für ein Thema… Nun bin ich heute Morgen auf eine Konversation bei gestoßen die mich zum Nachdenken gebracht hat. In einer Zeit von “Euro-Kriese”, Kriegen in Afghanistan und Irak rückt Israel immer mehr aus dem Bewusstsein, auch wenn der Türkische Präsident diese Debatte erst jüngst wieder befeuerte, fanden seine Äußerungen in den aktuellen Nachrichten eher wenig Beachtung. Deswegen hier ein Ausschnitt aus Twitter lest es und bildet euch eure Meinung:
M: Nothing is black and white, white what Israelis are doing isn’t right, a lot of shady things are going on in the other side too.
K: you’re kidding me right? I’m not in a mood for jokes right now.
K: I’m not saying there aren’t shady things all around the world, but it’s about more than just “what israel is doing isn’t right”
M: You can’t have peace while one people is colonizing a territory while the others call for the genocide of the said people.
K: either way, let’s drop the subject now, or talk on IRC, twitter is not the best medium for this kind of discussion.
M: What I am saying is that both parties are guilty ones and until compromises are made this is going nowhere, 50 years proved that
K: yes, btw, you should watch this if this subject interests you: youtube.com/watch?v=ycgi0h…
K: A criminal breaks into your house, kills and rapes your family, and the police say “let him, he suffered in his youth”, then ..
K: .. when you complain, people say you’re a terrorist then the “nicest” ones who think they understand how you feel are saying …
K: … saying “let’s compromise, let him live in your house and you live in the basement”, you can’t kick out the fucking criminal!!
M: Let’s just put it this way, if Palestinians want to get any kind of international recognition, they should hit military targets
M: Hitting civilians with rockets will not get the public opinion on their sides.
K: first of all, ALL israelis are paramilitaries, secondly, all ‘civilians’ are also stealing your land, and third, they are hitting
K: the damn military installations, when you get 2 israeli “civilians” dead per year by a stray rocket, then it’s fucking world news
M: If someone steals my house, I am not going to throw a rocket at him, I am going to complain through official channels
M: Or target the government that let the person steal my house.
K: but the hundreds palestinian civilians and children who die every week are not news worthy, fuck this shit man.
M: Yes, it makes world news, it wouldn’t if rockets weren’t fired. When they are it doesn’t serve Palestinians.
K: oh this is bullshit, international opinion? international recognition? what the fck is israel doing every single day? aren’t they
K: bombing, targetting, killing, civilians every single day, and yet, they have all the fucking international recognition they want
M: I am not saying that Israelis are the good guys by any mean, but trying to eradicate one side isn’t the way to go.
K: like I said, the “official channels” are telling you that it’s ok for him to kill you because “he suffered in the past”, .
M: Because whether it is the Palestinians, or the Israelis, both sides have clearly shown they aren’t moving from the area.
M: As such, compromises and peace have to be made and reached, that cannot be done through warfare.
K: ISRAEL must be eradicated, the people, no, by “israel”, it means the apartheid racist, nazi state of israel. that’s what it means
K: and FYI, I do not and cannot condone any kind or form of terrorism (remember my “no soul should be killed” rant a while ago?)
M: That is clearly not the vision the Hamas implies. And as much as I respect the cause, they aren’t doing things the right way.
K: all I’m saying is that self defense, freedom fighting, and acts of desperation, a direct cause of what israel does, is something
M: Yeah I know, and I am not saying there aren’t Palestinians that want peace.
K: that I can at least understand why it happens. the “terrorism” word is used in the wrong reasons when the US aren’t happy
M: Just like there are Israelis that do not agree with their governments policies (more than would actually think).
K: Hamas is requesting their people’s freedom and their land back, the state of israel must disappear, but not the population ..
M: The more you target civilians, the more animosity you will get from them and from the international community.
K: don’t forget that palestine has always been a refuge for jews, christians and muslims, then israel came and it became exclusive
M: If you want to have leverage and a way to end the conflict in your favor, you need to show that you’re the good side.
K: the thing is that peace *cannot* be attained with such a compromise. Like I said, compromise and live with the guy who raped you
M: Because the only way this conflict is going to end, is through international pressure, thus these opinions count.
K: you keep talking about civilians and international community and peace, how many civilians is israel killing EVERY DAY??????
M: Not every Israelis rape people, and not every Palestinians send rockets. Some actually do want peace.
K: international opinion is BS, Israel is murdering dozens of children every single day for years, with no cease fire ever, and yet.
M: Yes but you are forgetting something, the Palestinians have no means to fight against Israel’s propaganda machine.
K: yet they have the international opinion somehow AND people say “palestinians must stop” but never “israel must stop”…
K: even you, right now, you are biased pro-israel since you talk about hamas needing to stop but ignore the fact that israel does it
M: Even more as they target civilans and give fuel to those machines while getting public opinions against them.
K: ALL israelis go in the military, women or men and it’s mandatory, ALSO, *all* israelis are stealing land from its owners, true?
M: Basically 50+ years have shown that violence is in no way the key to resolve this conflict, for either sides.
K: the simple fact of living there is helping to promote apartheid and the depravation of a people’s right to return to their land
K: I know, and that’s the biggest issue, the fucking propaganda machine, bullshiting the world 24/7, it’s sickening.
M: In fact violence only serves 1. weapons dealers 2. the Israeli’s government 3. People like Ayatollah Khomeini 4. Fanatics.
K: violence is only fueling it, war allows those in power to stay in power and to sell their weapons continuously and get rich…
M: And yes, the Apartheid policy is wrong, but it cannot be resolved through violence, peaceful means have to take place.
K: I definitely agree with you on that. But the difference between self-defense and violence is so thin it’s hard to see it.
K: that’s what you don’t get, there are no peaceful means at all, israel continuously bombs them, never stops, what can you do ?
M: There was Apartheid in South Africa, the conflict wasn’t solved with everyone tearing each other’s up.
K: also don’t forget that they daily bulldoze random houses (even if you’re still in it), and burn crops of farmers, and blocus gaza
K: 95% of the palestinians are getting killed and 5% are fighting back, 95% of israelis are killing and 5% are not.. also..
M: Israel will stop dropping bombs if the Palestinians stop throwing rockets, they have to explain their policies to foreign govs.
K: ..also, when a tank sends a shell on a 5 year old with a rock in his hand, rocks versus RPGs I don’t see the “tearing each other”
M: Do you think that the U.S. Can continue to supply Isreal with weapons if they start slaughtering everyone ?
K: are you kidding me??? Israel is NOT stopping and will never stop and is *ALWAYS* the provocator, not the one defending himself.
K: also don’t forget that gaza is under an illegal siege for the last 4 years where the whole of gaza is an open air prison where ..
M: that isn’t true, 95% of the Israelis aren’t killing Palestinians and 95% of the Palestinians aren’t getting killed.
K: .. where people are starved and bulldozed everyday, in 4 years, every single day was a provocation, you really think they’d stop?
M: I agree however that the numbers aren’t in the favor of the Palestinians, but we are nowhere near these numbers.
K: lol, the US *IS* supplying weapons because they also want the fucking conflict!! you think what? the US are angels? fuck that
M: If Palestinians stop throwing rockets and blowing bombs, Israel won’t have excuses to justify their attacks.
M: The U.S. are supplying weapons because they want a stable base/ally in the middle east region and because of lobbying.
K: all israelis must go to the military and trust me the military are no angels, so yes, most israelis killed and tortured…
K: as for gaza people, they are under siege for 4 years uninterrupted, they are being tortured every day, so maybe 100% are, not 95%
M: Basically the UN are the pawn of : France, the UK, the US, Russia and China, not really the same thing.
K: they don’t need excuses, they just have a laugh when someone suicides out of desperation (direct reaction to israeli’s action)
K: yes, AIPAC is huge lobby in the US, and they want weapons to have a foot in the middle east and take it all over.
M: They need excuses, otherwise they become pariahs to the international community, some countries chose this (DPRK for example)
M: See how these countries are led now and the poor state they are in.
K: @littlesteve Israel has the most UN resolutions against it in the world, it applied none of them and 90% of them got vetoed by US
K: I see honestly no need for excuses for them, they have strong enough lobbies. Also the holocaust has always been their No1 excuse
M: I am not saying the UN is a fair place, in fact Palestinians aren’t even represented there.
M: That said, Palestinians didn’t show much opposition back then when the British Empire chose to send Jews to Israel after WWII.
K: I know, I don’t think anyone in the world thinks the UN is fair :p
M: Or when the British Empire colonized them before then.
K: 1- how to oppose, they were already colonized, 2- why oppose, it was a land for everyone, 3- they didn’t know they’d be cleansed
K: I don’t believe the british were execcuting whole cities over night, so they had no reason to oppose like the current colonizer..
K: @Nabelo alright, I think we pretty much shared what we had to say (for today anyways :p) but watch this : youtube.com/watch?v=ycgi0h…
To conclude : Long live Palestine, Long live Gaza! youtube.com/watch?v=GO5Cay…
M: You’d be surprised, they actually had no restraints in performing displays of force in case of riots.
K: probably not! I’m not surprised, Israel though came and executed entire villages to make place for their “land without people…”
M: It didn’t quite happened that way, British soldiers actually evacuated villages and told Israelis to settle there.
K: “evacuated”? you learned to use the same propaganda buzz words as them :p
K: anwyays dude, I’m tired and I want to get back to coding then sleep, so, good night, next time, on IRC please :p
…
greetz Eisenvater
. Sie sollen mal als rear-speaker für das 5.1 System im Wohnzimmer genutzt werden. Wie zu sehen ist, ist aller Anfang schwer aber wir kommen voran. Ein besonderer Dank geht an dieser Stelle auch an den Holzzuschnitt von Bauking in Wolfsburg, die uns das Holz auch in kleine teile gesägt haben. Wenigstens nicht zuviel Arbeit mit der Säge. Morgen oder nächste Woche geht es dann weiter.